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Discussion in 'Pre-CBS Strats (before 1966)' started by woodysdaydreams, Jun 14, 2019.

  1. woodysdaydreams

    woodysdaydreams New Member!

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    Hello, guys!
    Can you tell me something about this strat?
    Are there some original parts?
    Greetings Woody 817A5CD5-A221-47B7-A161-305F55882F7D.png 817A5CD5-A221-47B7-A161-305F55882F7D.png A1A59CBB-4F75-4468-861F-60FC7F4F575E.png 817A5CD5-A221-47B7-A161-305F55882F7D.png 817A5CD5-A221-47B7-A161-305F55882F7D.png A1A59CBB-4F75-4468-861F-60FC7F4F575E.png C9799354-72AD-4FCA-96E0-06ECDF769E1F.png 37E93BCF-A21E-497E-8C52-0148222C52D7.png E9099354-142D-4422-AB4F-699FA6FF6F2C.png AD9E2612-FDF3-4665-9C27-D9EAF00B559E.png 22AEF874-92E1-46A4-9AF4-E873A6972770.png 6FF8864F-CF56-4DD3-97F5-6414765A5814.png 8E34B615-00E5-4E1A-8969-6E1BDE6F94A1.png 439F8CC3-B433-4073-A5C7-A3A6E58A5F25.png
     
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  2. sgarnett

    sgarnett Strat-Talker

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    [Nevermind, I need to clean my glasses.]
     
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  3. rolandson

    rolandson Still Breathing Strat-Talk Supporter

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    ?
    Everything I rely upon to ascertain originality and authenticity is ... not as I would expect to see it.

    Then again, my experience is limited to early - mid 60's instruments. And, I'm no expert.
     
  4. Mipstoo

    Mipstoo Senior Stratmaster

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    We need more and better pictures to be completely sure and some more info would help... What is it being advertised as? Are you buying? Have you bought? Do you sell? :)

    At first sight.. there's not much original pre-cbs on this guitar. Sorry to disappoint you.
     
  5. Tone Guru

    Tone Guru Senior Stratmaster

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    It looks to be a mish-mash of parts from different eras.

    The logo that's been applied to the case is from late-'70s-early '80s period.
    That may be as much a clue as anything.

    The SN# is consistent with late-1960 to early-1961 if it is real.
    I can't hardly read any other markings except for "TG" on the heel which would be expected on a late '50s maple neck.

    Can you read the codes on the pots ?
    Need better high res shots of ... everything.
    Can you get your hands on a real camera ?

    Based on the pickguard screws holes and the grey bottom I'd say this guitar has gone through several re-do's, if any of it is in fact real and not "aged" repop parts.
     
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  6. Mipstoo

    Mipstoo Senior Stratmaster

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    Honestly, I don't see much real vintage parts:
    The case is a reproduction case. the guitar body has the hump in the control cavity so should be later than mid '59, but it also doesn't feature any nail holes which should place it after end '64 but since I also see no router marks (at least not on this pictures) which make me doubt this is a real old fender body. The routed wire channel looks not as what I'm used to see. What I can tell for sure is that the finish has a bad relic job done with the crazy checking everywhere. The saddles are reproductions without any tooling marks. The Tone and Volume knobs are repro. The cap on the pots 'looks' old but the pots are not the ones used in the pre-cbs days... As for the neck, there are not enough correct and good pictures to evaluate but again some things are hinting in the direction that it's a new neck. There is no finger and strum wear. The string tree is the wrong location. The logo hasn't oxidized and is still very gold colored.
    If you want to buy, steer clear or pay very little. It could be anything honestly...
     
  7. CB91710

    CB91710 This is a Custom Title Gold Member Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Body is drilled for at least two, possibly three different pickguards.
    Ditto on the "worm" route looking off.
    The neck... Yet another "TG" neck, funny how his initials never look the same, and no date stamp on the heel. Pre-1963 would have the date penciled on.
    Neck pocket is painted, again, no marks or stamps anywhere on the body (possibly a legit body that's been refinished)
    Pickguard has a foil shield only on the control cavity, that's CBS era stuff, as mentioned, the pots are not correct for the era that matches the capacitor. 70s era had ceramic disk.

    That guitar most certainly is not "all original", is most likely not vintage, and may very well be a Partscaster with few actual Fender parts.

    Also ditto on the case.
    If it is an original case, the value was destroyed by the Fender logo.
    The logo is not correct for the tweed era... it would have been used on a black Tolex case.
    The logo is not properly placed on the case, so it looks even more lame. Should be on the other end of the case, and MUCH closer to the endcap and closer to the hinge line.
     
  8. Bazz Jass

    Bazz Jass Chairman of the Fingerboard Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Have to agree with the jury on this one....steer clear!
     
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  9. tigger6

    tigger6 Strat-Talk Member

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    You haven't seen it in the south of Germany by any chance?
     
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  10. Alan Crossley

    Alan Crossley Senior Stratmaster

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    Exactly what do you believe it to be? The neck doesn't look right to me, but then I'm not sure what you think it is.
     
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  11. 3bolt79

    3bolt79 Senior Stratmaster

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    I just hope the OP hasn’t bought this already...
     
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  12. woodysdaydreams

    woodysdaydreams New Member!

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    Hey Guy's!
    Thanks so much for your numerous replies, feels great to be a part of the worldwide strat community.
    I have to apologize for the lack of details, but i did not had the time to formulate a proper post.
    My biggest dream is to own a vintage strat, because of that i'm always browsing through some online marketplaces ect.
    Yesterday i found this specimen on a german website (It's like craigslist for us europeans).
    It was listed as a partscaster with vintage parts. The seller wrote he bought it in the early 2000s in France for a huge amount.
    I was very sceptical, because the SN would date it to 60-61, but there are some huge issues Neck,shilding....
    I screenshoted the pictures, therefore i don't got better ones, sorry.
    The asking price is pretty decent, if it would be a strat with vintage parts.
    I was in shock and i thought finally i can realize my big dream.
    So you don't think it's worth it?

    Genau! Der Verkäufer lebt in der Nähe von Lörrach.

    Greetings Woody
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019
  13. Bazz Jass

    Bazz Jass Chairman of the Fingerboard Strat-Talk Supporter

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    There's a reason it's a decent price. The seller isn't out to make your dreams come true because he's a nice guy :)
     
  14. Mipstoo

    Mipstoo Senior Stratmaster

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    @woodysdaydreams, best way to venture into the vintage Strat world is to go for a refin. Depending on originality of the parts, you'll probably pay between 5 to 11.000€ in Europe. Don't expect any attic finds or sellers that don't know what they have. Over here they are as rare as gold donkeypoop... If it looks too good to be true, it probably is...
    It wouldn't make any sense to buy a partscaster with vintage parts if the parts are only the plastics or the bridge, most important will be the wood (neck maybe even more than the body) and electronics. Expect for this alone a minimum of 6000€ nowadays.
    I think, by the looks of it, this Strat have very little, if even at all, vintage parts. I'm even more concerned because I have the feeling it was made to make people think there are vintage parts. Can I ask you what the asking price is?
    I'm in Europe, I will let you know when I see something interesting.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019
  15. Alan Crossley

    Alan Crossley Senior Stratmaster

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    If you are looking for a decent, genuine 63 era Strat your going to need to be budgeting in the €10K range, give or take a few hundred , depending on provenance .

    Be very, very carefull, these are very easy to replicate and there a great many people out there happy to con you out off your hard earned money. The guitar just doesn't look right to me when I compare it to my own (dearly departed) 63.

    Lots of members have raised concerns as to its pedigree and I don't see any of their observations as being off the wall.
     
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  16. bluejazzoid

    bluejazzoid Strats Amore Strat-Talk Supporter

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    What is he asking for it?
     
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  17. Nate D

    Nate D Senior Stratmaster

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    That’s not a vintage Fender neck either.
     
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  18. rolandson

    rolandson Still Breathing Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Not having any idea what the asking price is, it's impossible to say.

    It's not a "Vintage" instrument, it's a partscaster assembled from what may, or may not be, old parts.

    Worth then, is entirely up to you.
     
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  19. tigger6

    tigger6 Strat-Talk Member

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    Yup. He's been trying to sell it for a few years now. He always relics it a little more and swaps some parts around and changes the story. I think it's worth a few hundred euros since some of the parts look like the more expensive repros.
     
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  20. Mipstoo

    Mipstoo Senior Stratmaster

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    Good thing he doesn't know much about old guitars then... ;)
    Lousy attempt to deceive and luckily nobody gets fooled like this ...:thumbd:
     
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