Example of "Tone is in the hands"

Discussion in 'Sidewinders Bar & Grille' started by Johnny Danger, May 18, 2020.

  1. joebloggs

    joebloggs Strat-Talker

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    :p:p:D:D:D:D Man that is awful! Especially around 2:10, what was that guy thinking? Even the guy playing the red shred(he was pretty bad as well) saying let's get out of here...o_O:D
     
  2. Johnny Danger

    Johnny Danger Senior Stratmaster

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    I guess I need to clarify.

    First and foremost tone is one thing, timbre is another. Timbre is the difference between acoustic and electric. You can play the same "tone" on different instruments and it will sound different because the timbre is different. I think we use the term interchangeably a lot and it's problematic. Or more so it's that we don't use the word timbre at all.

    People chase tone all damn day with gear, but usually fall short until they improve their technique. The clip I posted was an example of what you get when you have a very specific right hand attack on an instrument. Instantaneously swap out that acoustic for a strat and the right hand technique stays the same and you get SRV on electric. To get further into timbre vs tone, I think we actually chase timbre with gear thinking we will get the tone along with it.
     
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  3. Johnny Danger

    Johnny Danger Senior Stratmaster

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    To be clear, I had no real intention. Just saw the video and thought "Wow, that right hand action is pure badass."

    Tomo is awesome and a perfect example. I think I saw a video where he played a high end strat next to his Squier and it sounded SO close because his technique is so consistent.
     
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  4. Hydr0

    Hydr0 Strat-Talker

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    Call it tone, playing style, voice, whatever we like, to me this guy describes it best:
     
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  5. CajunJ

    CajunJ Strat-Talker

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    Excellent clip!
     
  6. 33db

    33db Senior Stratmaster

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    Finally... a hand tone thread.
     
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  7. 33db

    33db Senior Stratmaster

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  8. Groovey

    Groovey Most Honored Senior Member Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Hold up, I'll toss mine in too.
     
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  9. Nate D

    Nate D Most Honored Senior Member Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I actually think you can probably go ahead and make this a definitive statement :)
     
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  10. thomquietwolf

    thomquietwolf Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

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    now we're arguing paradigm and the English language...
     
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  11. guitarchaeologist

    guitarchaeologist Artist Formerly Known as π Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I'm still in isolation... gotta have something to do :)
     
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  12. dirocyn

    dirocyn Senior Stratmaster

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    This right here is the root of the whole "tone is in the hands" vs. "tone is in the gear" argument. "Tone" actually means both timbre and technique.

    Buying gear won't get you technique. Phrasing, the manner of plucking, the choice of notes--and for that matter knowing what sound you're looking for and how to turn the knobs to get closer to that sound--all that stuff is a matter of player choice. Technique.

    And different gear sounds different. Different guitars have different voices. Turning on a fuzz or overdrive pedal changes the sounds coming out of the amp. Using a different amp, or a different speaker changes the sound. Different guitars don't sound the same, even if the same guy is playing. SRV on acoustic doesn't sound like SRV on his electric rig, just like Clapton on Strat doesn't sound like Clapton on SG; Gilmour on a 12-string acoustic doesn't sound like Gilmour on a Strat. Timbre is all about the voice of the gear.

    And since tone actually means both things, both sides of this debate are correct--they're just using different meanings of the word "tone."

    And from here on, whenever we have that same old argument about tone, or questions about what pickups do which what to tone, I'm going to try and remember to talk about timbre instead.

    But it's gonna be hard to remember, 'cuz there are knobs on the guitar that effect timbre, and look how they're labeled:

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. thomquietwolf

    thomquietwolf Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

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    a87115fff0dc206f10b1dc1fc54ab907--smiley-facebook-smiley-faces.jpg
     
  14. fezz parka

    fezz parka Duke of Dilligaf Strat-Talk Supporter

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    The player makes the sound.

    I've heard some pretty crappy hands. LOL

    Now for where the rubber meets the road. Two guys. One guitar. One amp. One take. Passed between the two of them.

    Listen to it all the way through. When the "mama" voice says to share...they swap.

    If you can't tell which is Jimmie and which is Stevie...you're deaf.

    And if you can't hear a definite change in...tone...you're double deaf.



    Yes tone is in the hands, because the player makes the sound. :)
     
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  15. Fatmaninthebath

    Fatmaninthebath Strat-Talker

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    I have no audio or video but one of the best example I've heard came when we went to see Dickey Betts play shortly after the split with ABB. The guitar tech came out,tuned and checked out Dickey's guitar and amp. It sounded harsh very treble. Shortly Dickey came out , didn't touch a thing on the amp or guitar and started into High Falls. There was the sweet full Les Paul tone Dickey was known for. Definitely in his hands and brain
     
  16. Cesspit

    Cesspit Strat-O-Master

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    I believe tone is in the hands is not far away from the truth. On several occasions over the years, when playing with other guitarists we have swapped gear for a song, strat/twin for LP/Marshall and I've been told I don't sound that different and the tone is recognisable.
    I must point out that this doesn't mean I'm any good, just that I tend to sound the same what ever I am playing and I think there's some truth in that for all of us.
     
  17. Dreamdancer

    Dreamdancer Strat-O-Master

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    I never understood why there is still a debate about this...did anyone ever had ONE example where tone WASNT in the hands?.....in order to be a debate about it...you must know of some people that their tone sucks and when they play through their "dream rig" their tone sounds sublime.I dont believe such a person exists ,ever existed or ll exist in the future.So if you cant find a single person that makes that transition happen(without several months or years of practice between periods) i dont understand why there is still a debate about it....
     
  18. Stratomike

    Stratomike Strat-Talker

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    This has to be one of the best topics for Corona boredom. We can go in circles forever!

    So let me jump back to the first post/example: SRV through an acoustic guitar still sounds like SRV. Nobody claims the opposite. But it's not the same tone as him playing through his electric rig.

    Keep 'em coming...:whistling:
     
  19. Johnny Danger

    Johnny Danger Senior Stratmaster

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    Yeah, I knew this would happen, but I posted it anyway. Definitely not intended to stir up/start a debate, but this is an internet forum so it's the inevitable conclusion.

    Stratomike, I'm not sure why you seem keen on trying to put gas on this fire. But to your last post, I would say it's not the same timbre from acoustic to electric, but the tone is there. Tone being the dynamics, attack, sustain, intensity, etc. Timbre being acoustic vs electric.

    If you feel like you being "right" and me being "wrong" will make things right in your world, then let me take this opportunity to say: You're right, and I am so very wrong. I mean, I wasn't even trying to prove anything right or wrong to being with, but you seem excited to be right about something, so be my guest.

    Fezz posted a great example.
     
  20. fezz parka

    fezz parka Duke of Dilligaf Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I don't believe anyone said it was the "same". The point is...that if you know what the eff you're doing and make good music...you can get good tone anywhere. The Dickey example earlier is perfect. Sounded like ass until he picked it up.

    The player makes the sound. From the ears to the brain to the hands, the player makes the choices that define the sound. Note choice, technique, how you pick, where you pick. Or if you use a pick at all.

    I've played with Robben Ford on a front porch in Santa Monica back in the mid 80's. I was playing my Strat, my friend Scott was playing his 53 Les Paul. We were plugged into a 66 Deluxe Reverb. Robben...was playing a Dano U1 plugged into a little Magnatone practice amp. Guess who was killing it tonewise? Robben. That sound follows him.

    That's the point. If you don't get that, then fine. But discerning ears can hear it.

    Or as Bootsy Collins says "Those with ears can hear. Those who don't...get funked up."
     
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