Fat 50s not that quacky?

Discussion in 'Pickup Forum' started by edsdds, Jun 18, 2017.

  1. edsdds

    edsdds Strat-Talker

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    Is it just me or are the fat 50s so smooth that the difference in positions is more subtle. Especially in the 2 and 4.

    I know it's not a modern sounding pickup and I like them just wish it had a little more midrange and quack if I am explaining that right.
     
  2. Pete_C

    Pete_C Strat-O-Master

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    Try adjusting the middle higher or lower. The greater the difference in height the greater the quack, as far as I know.
     
  3. edsdds

    edsdds Strat-Talker

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    Ok will try that. Thanks.
     
  4. Vindibona1

    Vindibona1 Most Honored Senior Member Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Yes. Pickup height can make a huge difference in the sounds.
     
  5. johnnymg

    johnnymg Most Honored Senior Member

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    The problem with the Fat 50's quack is the pole height imbalance.

    I lowered the G and D poles (all 3 pups) and got the quack back. :D
     
  6. Ebidis

    Ebidis Providing the world with flat bends since 1985 Strat-Talk Supporter

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    As opposed to every other vintage type Strat pickup with the same pole stagger? Vintage Strats with the same stagger have plenty of quack.

    I suspect the real issue may be the RWRP middle pickup, but I have no data to back this up.
     
  7. edsdds

    edsdds Strat-Talker

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    Interesting. I might start with the pickup height but pole height I don't know if I will mess things up instead
     
  8. Antigua

    Antigua Senior Stratmaster

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    Fat 50's have a DC resistance in the 6k range. You get the most quack with Strat pickups that both use AlNiCo 5 poles and are wound in the 5k range, due to the fact that they have higher resonant peaks. The two most commonly available Fender sets that do this are the CS 69's or the 57/62's, or the plastic bobbin pickups that came stock in the American Standards.
     
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  9. Seymour Duncan

    Seymour Duncan Senior Stratmaster

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    If anyone is considering lowering the poles on our pickups at any time, don't. There is a good chance you'd cause a break in the coil.
     
  10. Mr. Lumbergh

    Mr. Lumbergh needs you to go ahead and come in on Sunday, too. Strat-Talk Supporter

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    So Fender pickups are more robust then?
     
  11. Seymour Duncan

    Seymour Duncan Senior Stratmaster

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    Or, less solid. :)
     
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  12. edsdds

    edsdds Strat-Talker

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    Is it just my ears or to me the fat 50s not very midrangy like others such as 57/62s, 69s, Tex mex, Texas specials etc ?
     
  13. RadioFM74

    RadioFM74 Senior Stratmaster

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    My Strat with Fat 50s quacks as much as my Classic Player 60s with Custom 69. Both quack alright to my ears. FWIW (and I really could not tell if that’s a factor) my Fat 50s are set very low (bass side flush with the pickguard)
     
  14. edsdds

    edsdds Strat-Talker

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    Got it. What about when it comes to the mid range of the 69 compared to the 50s? Is it on inherent trait of the guitars with 60s themed pickups to always have more mids?
     
  15. RadioFM74

    RadioFM74 Senior Stratmaster

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    To be quite frank, my feeling is that the differences are subtle and tend to disappear in the face of much more important factors (what amp you use, in the first place). Yes, the Fat 50s may have a slightly more scooped sound, but in both cases you’re pretty much in classic strat territory. If anything, the Fat50s seem a bit hotter to me, but when you set them very low this too tends to be attenuated.
     
  16. Antigua

    Antigua Senior Stratmaster

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    In general, the lower the inductance, the more quack you get. Most all Strat pickups have good quack in the notch positions, because the combined inductance of two Strat pickups in parallel is always very low, around one henry. That's the Sultans of Swing or Little Wing tone. Strat pickups will only have a quack like character by themselves if the inductance is really low, close to, or below two henries. CS '69's are right around 2 henries, but hotter pickups like the Texas Specials are closer to the 3 henries. 3 henries in series is only 1.5 henries, so even Texas Special will "quack" in the notch positions, but will sound bold by themselves.
     
  17. edsdds

    edsdds Strat-Talker

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    And a very very slight loss in volume is common in position 2 and 4 right. ?
     
  18. johnnymg

    johnnymg Most Honored Senior Member

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    Yes............ not so slight actually. Volume loss is due to the (slight) out of phase combination of the two pups.

    Have you found the quack yet?

    Just a pole push away! :p
     
  19. Mr. Lumbergh

    Mr. Lumbergh needs you to go ahead and come in on Sunday, too. Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Yes. When you put pickups in parallel, the overall inductance drops, and your output voltage goes down to about 60% of each pickup by itself.
     
  20. Antigua

    Antigua Senior Stratmaster

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    The comb filtering that results from cancellations is a part of it, but that mostly serves to color the tone ( http://www.till.com/articles/PickupResponse/ ). The fundamental and lower harmonics are not cancelled. The low inductance that you create by putting pickups in parallel is by far the bigger cause of low voltage output. V = I * Z http://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/inductor/parallel-inductors.html