Lesson #2 (4 diatonic chords, 2 arpeggios)

Discussion in 'Tab & Music Forum' started by dogletnoir, Aug 16, 2021.

  1. dogletnoir

    dogletnoir V----V

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    Using the same four diatonic chords (Cmaj7, Ami7, Dmi7, and G7) in the same rhythmic pattern of one chord per beat against a jazz shuffle feel, let's try working with this melodic pattern:
    C E G B up, then G E C A down using strings 6-3 in 2nd position.
    The ascending pattern is a C major 7 arpeggio, while the descending pattern outlines A minor 7.
    For a little variation, use C E G B up then G E G(held).
    We've extended things to two more strings, one lower and one higher, but we're still staying in the same basic area of the fingerboard for now.

    Here's the downloadable slower drum track again:


    If you're starting to get the hang of Lesson #1, you can start working on this as well.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2021
  2. guitarvegas

    guitarvegas Senior Stratmaster

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    Can we do anything else in relation to this key and apreggio or do we have to stick with those couple of notes.....because already my mind is hearing extensions to little runs......let me know. I don't want to break the rules.
     
  3. fezz parka

    fezz parka fezz parka

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    Discipline. Get some. Or go your own way.
     
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  4. guitarvegas

    guitarvegas Senior Stratmaster

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    something is wrong with the file. Reaper does not accept this one.
     
  5. Dimarzio54

    Dimarzio54 Strat-Talk Member

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    I studied briefly with great jazz guitarist Chuck Wayne. As has been noted here by others walk before run and take it slow. Chuck was all about the right hand technique and picking patterns. This exercise is good place to start and have patience. When I practice I use a metronome (sometimes) and a looper pedal. I work on 1 6 2 5 changes various keys and start slow and easy playing the arpeggios. Only when become proficient should you start dreaming about other possibilities. My 2 cents...
     
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  6. guitarvegas

    guitarvegas Senior Stratmaster

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    Here is mine. It's boring, but the purpose is not to make music, it is just practice. So here you go. Nothing fancy.
     
  7. Mouse

    Mouse The Knees of Rock

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    Here's my first attempt at lesson 2. I still did a chord only track to continue building hand strength. For the arpeggios, I tried to sing the name of each note along with my playing. While I know the formulas for chord construction, I can't blurt them out in an instant which I'd like to correct.

    Chords Only


    Arpeggios
     
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  8. dogletnoir

    dogletnoir V----V

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    Well, you are certainly free to do anything you want with the exercises on your own time once you have the basics down, but please try to refrain from posting anything here that isn't 'according to Hoyle'.

    One of the main points to these lessons is about getting back to the basics, and i think that a large part of the problem with what you're doing is that you are constantly over-reaching.

    Keep it simple and get the basics down first... then extend things from there.
     
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  9. guitarvegas

    guitarvegas Senior Stratmaster

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    True dat! I posted my example....painfully boring but I know it is essential!
     
  10. dogletnoir

    dogletnoir V----V

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    Solid advice!
    And Chuck Wayne was both a master improvisor and a great teacher.
    In fact, a copy of the Guitar Arpeggio Dictionary he did with Ralph Patt is sitting on the bed right next to me! A wonderful resource...
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2021
  11. fezz parka

    fezz parka fezz parka

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    You're building a vocabulary that you can make coherent music with. It's all about making music. Data and muscle memory that once it's ingrained you can think without thinking. Mushin. You just play. Otherwise you're making up your own language that no one can understand. ;)

    Mushin cannot exist without first compiling the data and muscle memory you need to simply make music without thinking.

    You have to know the rules in order to break them.

    Discipline and knowledge sets your mind and hands free.

    I do not fear the man who has practiced 10,000 kicks one time. I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times.
    :)
     
  12. guitarvegas

    guitarvegas Senior Stratmaster

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    Thank you sir.....and if I may say so, that was very well stated.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2021
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  13. dogletnoir

    dogletnoir V----V

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    Practice one kick 10,000 times.
    Just like fezz told you to.
    Think of it as an exercise in minimalism, and try to play all the way through with no mistakes and clean execution.
    Once you can do that, add some phrasing/articulation with slurs and some rhythmic variation, but still keeping to the two arpeggios.
    First you get the basic version down clean, then you add the feels.
    There's no reason something basic can't still be musical.

    In the end, it's not about how many notes you play, it's about how much you can make the notes you play mean.
    And that comes from practicing 'one kick 10,000 times'.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2021
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  14. dogletnoir

    dogletnoir V----V

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    :thumb: :thumb:
    Nice 'pocket' feel on those arpeggios, too.
    Try alternating between note names one time through and interval numbers the next time, so:
    C E G B / A C E G / D F A C / and G B D F, then
    1 3 5 7 / 1 b3 5 b7 /1 b3 5 b7 / 1 3 5 b7.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2021
  15. fezz parka

    fezz parka fezz parka

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    I'll just add a niggle. E's numbers here are for the root(s) of stand alone chords. They do not relate to the parent scale numbers I posted earlier.

    The 7's help you with the intervals of the parent scale and their relationship to the modal degrees, and the Roman numerals for the progression built.

    1-C
    1st degree = C Ionian.
    I ( Roman numeral) = Cmaj7.
    2-D
    2nd degree = D Dorian.
    ii (small roman numerals for minor) =Dm7.
    Etc. Etc. Etc. :)
     
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  16. guitarvegas

    guitarvegas Senior Stratmaster

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    confused....you guys lost me
     
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  17. Kerry Brown

    Kerry Brown Senior Stratmaster

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    Thank you, thank you, thank you for these lessons! I had a breakthrough in my playing this afternoon. I was noodling to a D Dorian backing track and all of a sudden in my mind I knew exactly what notes would go with what chords. I knew the substitute chords. I could play double stops, triads, you name it. I wasn’t thinking about scales I was thinking about notes to go with the chords. Previously I would have picked a scale and played in the scale hoping to land on chord tones. Who knew such simple seeming exercises could produce such rich results.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2021
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  18. fezz parka

    fezz parka fezz parka

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    When I first started learning...it was all about arpeggios and chord tones. Long before Aebersold modal noodling. :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2021
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  19. fezz parka

    fezz parka fezz parka

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    Count to seven. It's all about the number seven.
     
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  20. cranky

    cranky Senior Stratmaster

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    What's a question you could make out of this?

    Fezz's point is that, since you know the C major scale, you also know D Dorian, E Phrygian, F Lydian, G Mixolydian, A Aeolian (aka minor), and B Locrian.

    7 modes. Some folks argue that modes should be called scales in their own right, but either way.

    C major is the parent scale of those other scales. If someone says "let's play in D Dorian", all of the chords will be the same chords that belong to the key of C major (but you'll start on D instead of C). And you'll call D minor the i chord and C major will be the VII chord. And your minor 7ths will still be minor; the major 7ths still major.