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More trouble at the big G

Discussion in 'Sidewinders Bar & Grille' started by Mr. Lumbergh, Oct 21, 2017.

  1. guitarface

    guitarface Most Honored Senior Member

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    Perhaps getting a little off topic, but to elaborate on a theme that others here have alluded to, Gibson instruments are very expensive. I recently bought a used Les Paul Studio. The new, current version of it would go for $1500, I think. There are two problems with that $1500- 1) the cosmetic look of the guitar (the binding and the overall finish) announce to the world that it is some kind of budget, corner cut version of the real thing. 2) At that price point, you could get a fender American professional, which is basically they're flagship model. Moreover, you could get a MIM standard, that won't be lacking details that visibly tell either you the owner, or the outside world, hey, budget version over here.

    Point is, with the price points gibson is at right now, its hard to sell a lot of new guitars.

    FWIW, my budget looking les paul makes all the sounds I expect a Les Paul to make.
     
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  2. papergoblin

    papergoblin Strat-Talker

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    There's no seems to it, the top isn't looking at what people like/want. The whole company is being ran as a consumer electronics company. That's why the robot tuning and such have been pushed so hard.

    I get innovation, and it has a place. I see making the standard things that people have grown to know and love. I see trying new approaches with metals, woods, and electronics. The difference is trying new things and ramming things down people's throats.

    The same thing happened when CBS bought Fender and started messing around with things.
     
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  3. Vjerilood

    Vjerilood Senior Stratmaster

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    That's the point of the Studio, all the function without the form. But yeah then what's that $1500 for? You're right you could get not only a very nice MIM Tele but a nice amp too, plus some booteek humbuckers to get a HH sound. If they weren't a venerable name with tons of history they'd have priced themselves out of business a long time ago.

    I've played SGs and LPs I really liked and would have bought, but they're just too expensive. $1500 is my limit for a guitar and even then it would have to be really special. Maybe if Jimi owned it. I might pay $1500 for a Gibson Jimi owned. If it was in pristine working order and blueberry burst. Yeah maybe for blueberry burst.

    IMG_1689.JPG
     
  4. papergoblin

    papergoblin Strat-Talker

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    Good thing this isn't a Gibby site, you'd be tarred and feathered for using Blue and LP together, lol.
     
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  5. slowesthand

    slowesthand Senior Stratmaster

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    Except with the American Professional you don't get nitro finish, if you want that you need to pay $2000 for an AVRI.
    You can also buy a SG Standard with Nitro and binding for less money than an American Professional.
     
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  6. guitarface

    guitarface Most Honored Senior Member

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    I traded my SG for a MIM strat. I stand by that decision. :thumb:
     
  7. LPBlue

    LPBlue "That Guy", again...dammit! Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I get it, but I would still like own an SG like my old 67 SGC! I have Strats, a Tele, LP etc. but the SG is a bucket item for me.:cool:
     
  8. Wrighty

    Wrighty Most Honored Senior Member

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    You guys in the States may not know anything about an old established UK drum company called Premier.
    I bought a studio, I think for around £600. Less than a year later I was offered peanuts for it in px because a new one on the wall was £450. Guy in the shop said they yo-yo in price week on week. Instability made me wary of buying a Gibson again. Incidentally, the quality was nothing special. The finish on the back, (it was a gold top), was pitted, the grain feelable through the rather poor matt paint job and the frets were nothing special. Definitely sub Fender MIM
     
  9. Sarnodude

    Sarnodude Senior Stratmaster

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    It sure is, but you can only put up with so much rain. It starts in October, and stops in May.
     
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  10. Paperback Rocker

    Paperback Rocker Nitro-mancer Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I haven't forgotten, believe me.
     
  11. CigBurn

    CigBurn Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

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    This is my guess for the future..

    aia.jpg
     
  12. o6 oly white

    o6 oly white Strat-O-Master

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    I can't see any reason to buy a new les paul. If I were in the market for one, which someday I may be, I'd go after 2010 through 2013.
    I'm a prime example of what is wrong with this company since I like to buy new. They've managed to push away my business.
     
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  13. Biddlin

    Biddlin Senior Stratmaster

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    I am unaware that it is for sale. I really tire of these somebody ought to threads, bashing someone who DID, with his own money and sweat bring the company back from death and turn it into the $3 billion, 5000 employee holder of 40% of the market share of consumer musical instruments and accessories, worldwide. So how many of you guys are ready to make Henry the offer? It's easy to throw poo from the cheap seats. I'll be more receptive when I see spmeone step up to the plate and take a real swing.
     
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  14. Mr. Lumbergh

    Mr. Lumbergh needs you to go ahead and come in on Sunday, too. Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Then why post in them? Moreover, why should I have to have a bankroll big enough to buy out a company before I can link to an article about how they're not doing as well as they could?
     
  15. simoncroft

    simoncroft Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I used to write business columns for a number of magazines, including MI Pro, which is the UK's trade magazine for the Musical Instrument industry. As a result, I'm not normally careless with my words, nor prone to offering opinions for which I have no foundation.

    At no point did I claim that Gibson was for sale. My point was that, from the perspective of the core consumer base for its output (that would be a lot of us guitarists) we perceive that the company has made some strategic errors that almost any sensible focus group (that would also be guitar-playing folks like you) could have helped them to avoid. It's not unreasonable to suggest that the brand, and its guitars, could be better served under different leadership.

    It maybe seems unkind, a couple of years down the line, to keep pointing out that very few players actually wanted 'robot' tuners, a hologram of Les Paul, a rather overwhelming signature, or a visibly non-traditional nut on a Gibson guitar. But those were monumentally poor decisions that must have been taken with the full knowledge of the entire marketing and management teams.

    I would also support the view that by continuing to produce some of the lower-priced US-made guitars the company is in danger of eroding its 'gold card' standard. While it's a worthy ambition to protect your domestic labour force, the whole strategy will backfire if players decide what you're offering isn't up to much compared to what else they could have bought in-store.

    The fixed neck design is inherently more labour intensive than Leo Fender's more engineering-led creations, so if you insist on building low-cost guitars that way, you will end up creating instruments that look and feel somewhat ordinary. Selling someone an unsatisfying product can create very damaging perceptions of the brand, meaning they jump ship when they have more money to spend.

    There is no intention on my part to say that the current Gibson team has done 'everything wrong', when they clearly haven't. However, there are other manufacturers who have continued to appeal to guitarist's notoriously conservative tastes, while incorporating design innovations that make their instruments more useful to modern players. Some have also developed better strategies for maintaining brand loyalty from entry level to rock star level pricing.

    My most treasured guitar is a Gibson 335, and it's an instrument made in recent years. So I'm not a Gibson hater, and I'm certainly not looking at the past with a rosy glow. What frustrates me is seeing an historic brand compromised by bad decisions, when the good decisions would probably have cost the same money and made a lot of people happier. I include shareholders in that observation.
     
  16. o6 oly white

    o6 oly white Strat-O-Master

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    These forums are for us (consumers) to discuss exactly this. What we want, like, dislike, our experiences and opinions.
     
  17. o6 oly white

    o6 oly white Strat-O-Master

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    Perfect! Well said.
     
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  18. Mr. Lumbergh

    Mr. Lumbergh needs you to go ahead and come in on Sunday, too. Strat-Talk Supporter

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    There goes Simon making a bunch of sense again...
     
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  19. Biddlin

    Biddlin Senior Stratmaster

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    I just did. Sorry I'm not in lockstep with the fora illuminati, but I have been playing and buying Gibsons for 50+ years, have had one out of perhaps twenty that was a dud and that was from the "golden age" of the 60s. I currently have a small herd of Nashville models that are all first rate guitars. As to speculation over Henry's business plans, if he's wrong, maybe some of you wise men will cobble together the scratch to put your marketing theories to the test, but based on past performance, I'll bet Henry's heirs inherit the Gibson corp before it goes belly up.
     
  20. o6 oly white

    o6 oly white Strat-O-Master

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    I don't see it going belly up.
    Do you like the new models? 2014 to the current offerings?
     
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