MV For Budda TwinMaster Amp??

Discussion in 'Amp Input - Normal or Bright' started by zozoe, Jan 12, 2020.

  1. zozoe

    zozoe Strat-Talker

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    Hi all~ I'm strongly considering having a master put in my Budda TwinMaster, but I wanted some feedback (literally!) from those of you who have had some success with this. I assume PPIMV means I'd be affecting the signal after the power tube section, and/or is there another MV that might better suit this unique amp? FWIW, I use mostly the high gain input.

    Thanks, Kenny
     
  2. Triple Jim

    Triple Jim Most Honored Senior Member

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    A PPIMV goes after the phase inverter (post phase inverter) and before the power tubes. There are several types of these. The "Lar-Mar" type is one, and from my experience I highly recommend it. When all the way up, the circuit is exactly like it was before adding the MV, and when turned down it has minimal effect on the tone.

    I'm not familiar with your amp and didn't find a schematic when I looked, so I don't know for sure the compatibility of the Lar-Mar with it, but it's probably compatible. Post a schematic and I'll know for sure.

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. fezz parka

    fezz parka fezz parka Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Is it an old one or Peavey built?


    I'd just use a volume box in the FX loop.
     
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  4. Robins

    Robins Dr. von Loudster Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Yeah, as @fezz parka mentioned, the FX loop volume box will do the job just fine.
     
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  5. AngeloEvs

    AngeloEvs Strat-Talker

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    The most common placement of a Master Vol on the majority of valve amps is between the final stage of the pre amp and phase splitter (using a single 1M log pot).

    A schematic or qualified engineer will quickly identify the best placement for a MV.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
  6. Miotch

    Miotch Senior Stratmaster

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    Shouldn't matter if pre-Peavey or post Peavey purchase, from all I've read. But I personally wouldn't modify the Budda. I, too, would go for volume pedal or similar in effects loop.
     
  7. fezz parka

    fezz parka fezz parka Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Meaning one would be more valuable than the other. Like Fryette era VHT vs the new ones.
     
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  8. bluejazzoid

    bluejazzoid Strats Amore Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I have a TM, and as recommended a volume pedal in the FX loop gives you all the glory of a PPIMV -- hands-down, best way to go.

    Unless, of course, you absolutely cannot resist fixing that which is not broken! ;)
     
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  9. Triple Jim

    Triple Jim Most Honored Senior Member

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    I'm sure it works very well, but it's not the same as the post phase inverter version, so it's not really "all the glory".
     
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  10. Miotch

    Miotch Senior Stratmaster

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    Maybe. But having been watching Superdrive 18s for a couple of years now, the asking price difference seems marginal at best. Never priced Twinmasters. Most of the ads I've seen don't seem to make a differentiation. Some do, but not a lot. Of course, we might make the assumption, that if no pre-Peavey mentioned in ad, then it is a post-Peavey amp. Don't really know. The asking prices for them are all over the place.

    What I was really getting at was the circuitry. You may be completely right on the inference you are throwing away more money by modifying a pre-Peavey one, vs. a post-Peavey one.
     
  11. bluejazzoid

    bluejazzoid Strats Amore Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Okay, true — not the exact same thing, but still a very good way to be able to crank it up! (and w/o any permanent mods to the circuit)
     
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  12. Triple Jim

    Triple Jim Most Honored Senior Member

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    There's where I have an advantage... since I never sell anything I don't worry about resale value!
     
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  13. bluejazzoid

    bluejazzoid Strats Amore Strat-Talk Supporter

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    That is indeed the best advantage!

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. rocknrollrich

    rocknrollrich Senior Stratmaster

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    Volume control in the fx loop does not equal a PPIMV.

    Tonally different. Reactively different.

    As mentioned by Triple Jim.

    I would however recommend trying the volume pedal in the fx loop first.
    If that gets you to where you want to be, awesome. You saved yourself a trip to the amp tech.
     
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  15. bluejazzoid

    bluejazzoid Strats Amore Strat-Talk Supporter

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    I think the big issue is not everyone may love a PPIMV with certain amps, yet the only way to implement one and find out is to put it in there! So the volume pedal in the FX loop trick is a nice way to have similar fun without modding something only to find out you don't actually like the mod.

    Besides, even with a PPIMV you're not really getting the power tubes involved (like with a cranked amp), you're just overdriving the PI (right?). I think an attenuator is the only way to get the big stuff cooking (or having great earplugs :p), but still there's no happy consensus on what you get going that route.

    Everyone's mileage varies, yada yada yada :)
     
  16. Triple Jim

    Triple Jim Most Honored Senior Member

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    Maybe, if the circuit is capable of overdriving the PI. But you might be surprised at how many all tube amps don't actually drive the output tubes into distortion anyway. We hear loud distorted output and sometimes assume the power tubes are being overdriven, but there are a lot of amps that get all that tone in the preamp, and the power amp just amplifies the already distorted sound.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2020
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  17. bluejazzoid

    bluejazzoid Strats Amore Strat-Talk Supporter

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    That's my understanding too... when talking about overdriving the PI, I really meant in addition to the preamp tubes, etc.

    Of course with an amp like the Twinmaster, it was really designed to be cranked ---power tubes rolling--- and is pure joy to experience like that (that is, w/proper hearing protection!:eek:).
     
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  18. DonA

    DonA New Member!

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    I've tried a volume control in the FX loop of my Twinmaster and it sounded nothing like the sound of the amp cranked or the amp through an attenuator. This amp has a pretty low gain preamp and counts on either the phase inverter or the power tubes (or both) being pushed to get it's driven sound. And what a sound
    that is! Loud ad heck, though!

    If the speaker jacks were not on a board, I'd pull one and install a PPIVM to see how it sounds, but I won't be drilling any holes in this beautiful amp.
     
  19. bluejazzoid

    bluejazzoid Strats Amore Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Well, I still say the volume pedal f/x loop trick is a nice alternative to modding the amp with a PPIMV...... but you are correct about how the Twinmaster is designed, and it's really only at it's best when cranked! :cool:

    The few times I've actually ran my TM wide open (with hearing protection, lol), there's really no other solution that produces anything like *THAT* sound. :)
     
  20. DonA

    DonA New Member!

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    I generally plug a guitar with humbuckers into the Normal input on the amp with the amp's volume set between 3:00 and 4:00 for a dirty sound that I can clean up from the guitar. Then use a boost for more dirt. It's a glorious sound!
    If I'm using the Hi Gain input I set the amp's volume between 1:00 and 3:00 and clean up from the guitar with no pedals used.

    It's loud set up as shown below, even with the Hot Plate set at -8db.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2020
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