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Red strat owners club!

Discussion in 'Guitar Owners Clubs' started by WhammyDawg, May 30, 2011.

  1. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    Which rather proves that it didn't happen! Anything may have been "possible", but that doesn't mean it happened. Fullertons were Fullertons, JVs were JVs, the rumours about connections about the two types continue, but they are simply rumours.

    The internet is great at rumours....... We need to make sure that a reliable site like ST doesn't feed unfounded rumours.
     

  2. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    Thank you so much!

    It's just got me stumped how a pre-patent Kahler circa 1979-80 (one of only 500 made - this run/design) ended up on my 1983 JV Squier Stratocaster.

    I have had the guitar since brand new since the 1980's with this Kahler trem on it.

    I thought maybe the Kahler was installed in the US... or Japan... I don't know yet

    Just thinking outside the box...
     

  3. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    Thanks,

    I thought the JV Stratocaster '62 reissues were pretty close replicas of the US made 1962 Stratocasters?

    But as you said, maybe the body contours of the JV's were quite different to the Stratocasters coming out of the US circa 1980's?
     

  4. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    Sometimes it's better to see if thinking inside the box solves the problem before worrying about about leaving the box....

    Fender Japan guitars were available with a variety of different 1980s style flashy locking trems to match the very specific fashions of the era. As the years went on, Fender Japans were available with Kahlers, Floyd Roses, & then Fender's own range of locking trems, the System One, System Two & System Three. The catalogues were full of them, the guitar shop walls were full of them. At one time (when I bought mine in 1987) it was hard to find a Fender Japan Strat that didn't have a locking trem of some kind! Thankfully this fashion soon died out & Strats returned to having vintage style trems.

    There is no reason whatsoever why any locking trem would have been installed in the US. Just think about the logic of this for a moment - Fujigen were contracted by Fender to make the Fender Japan guitars, starting with the JVs in 1982. They were fully competent guitar makers - that's why they got the job! Fullerton & Fujigen worked independently - neither needed help from the other to make their guitars.
     

  5. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    No, the JVs were not based on the AVRIs, they were based on blueprints sent to Fujigen by Fender US. The guitars were made separately & independently of each other.

    Since the JVs appeared before the AVRIs, there is no way the JVs could have copied the American product. And no reason to surmise that they might have been.

    The JVs & the Fullertons have numerous differences that enable us to distinguish one from the other. There is no confusion here - the only confusion is caused by the rumours you have been listening to....
     

  6. blueworm

    blueworm Senior Stratmaster

    May 6, 2012
    Germany
    There IS some connection between US reissue series and the JV series as some high end JVs were equipped with same pickguard assembly (including the 57/62 pickups) and tremolo bridge, all shipped from the US.

    But I agree: nothing supports the fact that bodies (or necks) followed the same path. That doesn't make sense.
     
    1983jvsquier likes this.

  7. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    Thank you for your input!

    I was just trying to verify the information I read on the website below (I am just trying to gather information so that I have a truthful record about the origins of my JV... not trying to upset anyone or spread rumours...)

    Again, many thanks for your assistance :)

    What do you make of this:

    "...when you buy a Fender Japanese 80's Strat or Telecaster, you are playing not only a piece of Leo Fender History, But Leo Fender's made pre 65 plugs Fuji modified into a great playing machine..."

    quoted from http://www.stratconnection.com/fujigengakki.htm
     

  8. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    I already mentioned that some of the earliest JVs had US made pickups. That practice soon ended, but the idea was dragged up again years later when Fender Japan offered some higher end models with US made pickups - unfortunately they were Texas Specials...

    But that small & relatively irrelevant fact has given rise to a whole raft of other rumours based on nothing at all. And our new friend here seems to have heard all the incorrect rumours & allegations & believed them.
     

  9. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    I have never seen that page before, but it seems to me to be fiction, speculation & sheer imaginary nonsense. I prefer to deal in facts that we can prove on here to one man's opinion on a website that he controls. There is no option on that page for readers to say

    "This is all bollocks!"

    The writer of that page seems to struggle with basic English.....o_O

    On here, we do have that option. If blueworm or I, or anyone else makes a statement that "x is true", we have to be prepared to back it up. And if I say something that isn't true, someone else will come along & tell me that I'm wrong. That's good.

    That's why I trust what I read on here rather than other, less well-informed sources, like that page that you have been reading & that has been confusing you so much. Ignore it - it's crap.
     

  10. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    I've just forced myself to read a bit more of that ridiculous page. Dear God....

    His theory is this:

    "And when you see the original 1982 JV Squier made exactly as the 1962 Fender Stratocaster Except for a back plate and small decal. You have to wonder whose parts are these. I know whose they was, they were Leo's over stocked warehoused parts sold to CBS that they didn't use at first because they wanted to change and make their own form of Strat starting with the large head four bolt 1967 we know Jimi Hendrix made famous."

    So - pay attention now everyone. :D Apparently, in 1965, Leo sold various parts to CBS. CBS didn't use these parts, they kept them locked away somewhere until 1982. In 1982 they needed them. Fender had decided to make guitars in Japan so they found all this old stock & shipped it over to Japan & got their new contractor to assemble them all.

    OK, right! :rolleyes: So presumably they did this because their new contractor, Fujigen, was incapable of making guitars on their own? If that was true, why would Fender US have employed them? And what about the fact that Fujigen had been successfully making quality guitars for various brands such as Greco for several years? Were those Grecos also made from parts left over from 1965 in California? Or (bit of a radical thought this one...) were Fujigen actually capable of making high quality guitars themselves?

    Boy oh boy oh boy! It's no wonder you're confused, my new friend, you have just absorbed the contents of the most absurd webpage about Fender it has ever been my misfortune to read. :mad:

    At least I now understand why you were so confused. Ignore every word of that page & never visit it again! :D :eek: :mad:
     

  11. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    There is something specifically unusual about my guitar having the early Kahler (only 500 made worldwide - confirmed by Kahler directly recently)... Kahler has also had a complicated history and relationship with Fender...

    I have been scouring the internet for months looking for information...

    I wish I could find someone with a guitar that has a Kahler trem design like mine to assist with my research...I've created a Kahler thread so hoping one day that will happen :)

    Thank you to everyone for your input!
     

  12. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    I don't know the story behind the Kahler, I have always hated them & avoided them. It is a slight mystery, perhaps. But in looking for the answer to that slight mystery, you have stumbled upon the disjointed ramblings of a lunatic obsessed with conspiracy theories & whose brain seems to have turned to much decades ago!
     

  13. blueworm

    blueworm Senior Stratmaster

    May 6, 2012
    Germany
    They had Kahler trem back in '65 ?

    Oh yes I get it ... shipped to the Shetland Islands for inspection and then brought to the Moon with the Apollo 18 mission and ... wait ... How the hell did Fugijen finally got their hands on these ??! :confused:
     

  14. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    The Kahler is already confirmed as an after-market install in the 80's...[​IMG]
     

  15. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    The first batch of Kahler bridges were sold to Fender... the Kahler factory was situated close to the Fullerton factory
     

  16. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    By the way, this is the wrong place for this discussion - you should have started a new thread to discuss this entirely new & confusing problem.
     

  17. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    I am the proud owner of a beautiful red 1983 JV Stratocaster with first-run Kahler...

    [​IMG]
     

  18. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK
    Now you're contradicting yourself! Earlier you said you bought the JV with the Kahler already fitted - now you're saying that "The Kahler is already confirmed as an after-market install in the 80's..."

    I do wish you would make up your mind! This whole saga has taken up a lot of time & is unnecessarily confusing.
     

  19. stratman323

    stratman323 Dr. Stratster Strat-Talk Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Apr 21, 2010
    London, UK

    Now what are you doing? Why have you posted the same thing yet again in an inappropriate thread?
     
    bernwolf likes this.

  20. 1983jvsquier

    1983jvsquier Strat-Talk Member

    32
    Oct 13, 2016
    Australia
    Yes the guitar was purchased with the Kahler already fitted.

    My question has always been where was it fitted?