Wrighty
Dr. Stratster
where did it all go wrong?
So far ahead and then, well, British Leyland……….
- Thread starter Wrighty
- Start date
where did it all go wrong?
IMO, too many independent car manufacturers turned into badges on the front of sub-standard cars produced by a disillusioned workforce who no longer felt the slightest loyalty towards the conglomerated organisation they found themselves employed by. Also, I suspect that many of the people on the shop floor had seen what 'rationalisation' and 'efficiency' had done to many of the people they used to work alongside and no longer believed they had long-term job security.
Once you have a workforce that despises the management, producing bad product is the emotional equivalent of kicking the boss's horse while you're out in the yard.
Once you have a workforce that despises the management, producing bad product is the emotional equivalent of kicking the boss's horse while you're out in the yard.
Stu78
Senior Stratmaster
Same could be partly said of Fender workers in the later CBS years. Hence the wildly inconsistent products. Dodgy Strats a plenty!
Agreed. I had a pretty nice Strat from about 1978 (despite a neck pocket you could wedge picks in), but the Fender Jazz I bought new in 1974 had neck issues.Same could be partly said of Fender workers in the later CBS years. Hence the wildly inconsistent products. Dodgy Strats a plenty!
To be fair, all the US guitar manufacturers had problems back then. Gibson lost a lot of skilled staff to a car plant that paid better, and the new guitars could be really so-so. I met a guy with a Les Paul, where the worker had started out cutting the neat little nibs in the binding that cover the ends of the frets on a Custom, then gone "nah!" around the 7th fret and just taken an engineer's file to the rest, rough abrasion marks and all.
Around that time, a friend bought a 12-string Rickenbacker with about the worst cut nut I have ever encountered.
Butcher of Strats
Senior Stratmaster
IDK, BMW bought the Mini Cooper?
British Leyland, lol, that takes me back. I have a card saying I'm a factory trained British Leyland mechanic. I still have a 73 Triumph TR-6. Pretty much every brand under that name was fun to drive and HIGH maintenance.
I owned a TR7 when I was in the Army. I spent 4 years tearing around Europe in it, including several weekend jaunts on the Nürburgring. High maintenance doesn't say the half of it.
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ThreeChordWonder
Senior Stratmaster
All cars up to the 80s, really, were "high maintenance". Tappets (or worse, shims) instead of hydraulic valve lifters, points and timing to set, carbs to adjust and balance, probably a decoke every 12,000 miles and a new engine at 100,000. If the body didn't rust away first due to crummy body design (spot welded joints) and crummy 70s steel (loads of sulfur).
The real problem with British Leyland was (1) nationalization; (2) 70s trade unions out to earn twice as much for doing half as much and refusing to modernise working practices, and (3) having too many brands under the same roof competing against each other. Just like GM for the past 30 years. They didn't even standardize basic components in most cases.
Some of BL's cars were actually pretty good, but the rest...
The real problem with British Leyland was (1) nationalization; (2) 70s trade unions out to earn twice as much for doing half as much and refusing to modernise working practices, and (3) having too many brands under the same roof competing against each other. Just like GM for the past 30 years. They didn't even standardize basic components in most cases.
Some of BL's cars were actually pretty good, but the rest...
Point taken, but BMW took a specialist high-performance design, based on a fairly cheap-and-nasty rust bucket car, and turned it into a well made vehicle.
IMO, every BMW Mini is better suited to the modern world than the original, which was designed to be affordable to drivers with far less money than today.
Believe me, the original Minis were not examples of great engineering. A fun drive, but not built to last. Cooper's guys certainly upped the acceleration, but they only fixed some of the problems.
As a younger, poorer man, I spent enough time driving and fixing Minis to know how basic they were.
ThreeChordWonder
Senior Stratmaster
The "new" Mini BMW bought was the last hurrah of Rover's design team. They didnt have the money to put it into production, however. I think my university classmate Hayley worked on it.
My Rover 620ti bought new in 94 or early 95 was a Honda Accord body with Rover trimmings. 200 ponies from a 2 liter 4-banger and clocked at 150 by the Gendarmerie Nationale somewhere east of Bordeaux.
My Rover 620ti bought new in 94 or early 95 was a Honda Accord body with Rover trimmings. 200 ponies from a 2 liter 4-banger and clocked at 150 by the Gendarmerie Nationale somewhere east of Bordeaux.
Butcher of Strats
Senior Stratmaster
Well yeah, Brit cars get lots of love but Lucas and rust and scary at speed etc is the reality of many.
I had two Austins, one America which us the slightly bigger Mini.
Loved that car except the 1.1L struggled goung up hills.
Had a German built Buick Opel GT with some dismal Bosch and Solex horrors, yet again, loved the thing.
Had a German built V6 Mercury Capri and again, so many ways it as bad and somehow it was good.
The BMW Mini in the US is well loved but it seems only until its got some years and miles, then I hear they become a nightmare.
Funny locals here LOVE their Subaru's and dont mind spending $3000 on big motor repairs after 100k mles?
Then they buy another and again justify motor problems.
Brand loyalty!
I owned a ‘65 MGB which I drove 100K miles exclusively in the Northeast, including 4 winters in East Lansing.
In ‘73 I exchanged it for a new ’73 MGB-GT which spent it’s entire life in Southern California with frequent cross country forays to visit family and friends.
Although I put over 100K on it as well, the BLMC product was definitely inferior With all sorts of starter, engine, electrical and general finish issues, not the least of which was the detuned-to-79 HP engine in order to meet the nascent US emissions requirements. Fortunately it never failed on the long road trips but it frequently provided me with all sorts of miniature thrills by suddenly cutting out at speed on the Pasadena Freeway or brakes failing on the San Bernardino Freeway. It was in the shop of a bunch of rip-off artists in Pasadena a lot. They will go unnamed.
P.S. After I traded it in for a new ‘78 Toyota Celica I found out they sold it and shortly thereafter caught fire on the poor guy who bought it. .
P.P.S. The other car I was considering at the time I bought the B-GT product was something they called a 240-Z. And it was $300 less expensive. I remember saying to myself “Self. Do you really want a Japanese car?”
Ah, Youth.
In ‘73 I exchanged it for a new ’73 MGB-GT which spent it’s entire life in Southern California with frequent cross country forays to visit family and friends.
Although I put over 100K on it as well, the BLMC product was definitely inferior With all sorts of starter, engine, electrical and general finish issues, not the least of which was the detuned-to-79 HP engine in order to meet the nascent US emissions requirements. Fortunately it never failed on the long road trips but it frequently provided me with all sorts of miniature thrills by suddenly cutting out at speed on the Pasadena Freeway or brakes failing on the San Bernardino Freeway. It was in the shop of a bunch of rip-off artists in Pasadena a lot. They will go unnamed.
P.S. After I traded it in for a new ‘78 Toyota Celica I found out they sold it and shortly thereafter caught fire on the poor guy who bought it. .
P.P.S. The other car I was considering at the time I bought the B-GT product was something they called a 240-Z. And it was $300 less expensive. I remember saying to myself “Self. Do you really want a Japanese car?”
Ah, Youth.
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Stratafied
Dr. Stratster
I loved the MGB.
I had a 240Z. Great car, one I definitely regret selling.
I've got my dad's 70 MG Midget out in my driveway. I got it going again after he left it to sit for years. Another British Leyland car. Crap electrics, particularly the starter. All the switches suck, the jokes about Lucas are right on the money. The fuel pump is a nightmare, the replacement parts let me down repeatedly.
It's a primitive design poorly executed, but still fun to drive. When it's working. Gets between 25 and 30 mpg, which was good back in the day.
I haven't started it In a couple of years, im sure it needs even more work now.
It's a primitive design poorly executed, but still fun to drive. When it's working. Gets between 25 and 30 mpg, which was good back in the day.
I haven't started it In a couple of years, im sure it needs even more work now.
I hear ya. Their cars were never good for daily drivers. Fun for a jaunt with the top down though. As long as they didn't quit, that is.
The 240Z is definitely the car I regret not buying. Shortly after I drove the B-GT to SoCal I roomed with a law student who owned the Z I didn’t get. I experienced the difference immediately.
Seamus OReally
Outta here
My first car was the predecessor to the 240Z, a 1969 Datsun 2000. Two-litre two-seater ragtop with a five speed manual in a car that was so light it threatened to drive right off its frame. I drove that Datsun like a rally car for a couple years, with the top down until it snowed. It was like a souped-up MGB… a barrel of monkeys.
I did love driving both of them. I even went as far to re-write “Let It Be” as “M-G-B”.
I recall one of the lyrics was “And when the night is cloudy I have Lucas Lamps to shine for me. Shine until tomorrow MGB”
