Some "yeah, buts" on electric vehicles?

Discussion in 'Sidewinders Bar & Grille' started by cranky, May 22, 2021.

  1. T Bone Slort

    T Bone Slort "Was you ever bit by a dead bee?" Silver Member

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    We are not only talking apples and oranges with the cars, we are also talking apples and oranges with the driving conditions which play a roll in the design and driving dynamics of vehicles.
    Typically North American vehicles were designed and marketed for the long distances between destinations, while that has changed somewhat in the last 30 years, that culture is still prevalent.
    I have driven in the UK on one lane roads with pull overs at skinny little bridges, that would not cut it in North America.
    Your A1 is 410 miles long, that would not even get me out of British Columbia (640 miles wide).
    Our friends from the Toronto area are diving one of their Teslas (either their S or the 3 not sure which) out to BC for a visit this August. They will travel more than 2000 miles one way.
    Oh and Petro Canada has DC fast charging stations approx. every 200 miles across Canada, not to mention most hotels have at lease 2 level 2 chargers that can be reserved.
     
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  2. Blackmore Fan

    Blackmore Fan Senior Stratmaster

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    In this thread: China gets lauded for its contributions to the environment and similarly applauded for its ease in "being in it together and curbing the conflicts of interest". Yeah, those *authoritarian* lock-down societies surely do have an easier time "being in it together and curbing the conflicts of interest".
     
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  3. T Bone Slort

    T Bone Slort "Was you ever bit by a dead bee?" Silver Member

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    The regeneration feature in EVs is something to behold. I can drive my wife's Bolt all day without ever touching the brakes, even in downtown traffic.
    As soon as I ease my foot off the accelerator the car is generating electricity back into the batteries as it comes to a stop.
    It is so effective that I was worried that since I was not touching the brakes my brake lights would not warn those behind me that I was slowing or stopping.
    I had a buddy follow me and flash his lights when my brake lights came on... he said they activated as soon as he detected a change in my speed
     
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  4. Blackmore Fan

    Blackmore Fan Senior Stratmaster

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    If ever there's been a government more keenly interested in the input of its citizens, its got to be China....said no person ever.
     
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  5. Blackmore Fan

    Blackmore Fan Senior Stratmaster

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    0-60 in 6.5 seconds is now the equivalent of a missile?
     
  6. HighwayStar106

    HighwayStar106 Senior Stratmaster

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    I'd totally forgotten, but yes, they did make an electric 106. Apparently it lasted from 1995 to 2003 and they sold over 6,000 of them. I imagine both range and speed were woeful compared to modern EVs.

    That's true, an 18 wheeler could probably run over my 106 without even noticing! Nevertheless, my point was that a lighter car will always be dynamically superior to a heavier equivalent, which is still relevant whatever two figures we're comparing.
     
  7. Andrew Wasson

    Andrew Wasson Senior Stratmaster

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    Because the weight difference is inconsequential. The EV is still a light car. It's not some 6,000 lb behemouth that you guys are claiming it is and due to weight distribution, the EV (Tesla Model 3) handles better because it has less weigh over the front wheels than my conventional car. It's very close to 50/50. It probably has better geometry too because of the wheels being farther front and back than my Kompressor.

    Weight Distribution My Car: 55% front | 45% rear

    Weight Distribution Tesla Model 3: 47% front | 53% rear

    Now, if I were looking for an affordable performance EV machine, I'd get the AWD Model 3 with dual motors and the full sport package. It's set up for sport and does the job.

    Three years ago Road and Track took it to Lime Rock Park to run laps. Three years is a long time in the world of EV so I can only imagine there have been imporvements since then but the article is a decent glimps of the road worthiness of an EV. You can read about it here: https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/road-tests/a22625274/tesla-model-3-performance-track-test/

    It's a good read and the writer talks honestly about the limitations of batteries plateauing under the stress of full on running laps on a race track but to cut to the chase, read the last bit:

    Let's be honest. This isn't a "track car." It's not meant to compete with the Camaro ZL1 1LE, Mustang Shelby GT350R or the dearly-departed Dodge Viper ACR. If you're buying a four-door sedan, even a righteously quick one, you're probably not planning on chasing apexes and torturing tires with it every weekend.

    In that context, the Tesla Model 3 Performance does a realistic job of delivering impressive numbers and unbeatable feel. It's quick, it's tossable, and unlike everything your garage buddies told you, it won't melt at the mere whisper of a full-speed lap. It's a compelling argument for feelsome, charming electric cars. No surprise, given who built it: Neumeyer's garage includes a BMW 2002 and a Porsche 912, while Moravy wrenches on vintage Volvos in his off time.

    What they've created along with the entire Tesla team is the world's first electric sport sedan with bona fide race track chops. That's important for electric car technology, for motorsports culture, and for the future of the automotive hobby as a whole.
     
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  8. Blackmore Fan

    Blackmore Fan Senior Stratmaster

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    You mean except for the pesky fact that we don't elect "global" leaders but instead elect local, state, and national ones?
     
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  9. BuckNekkid

    BuckNekkid Strat-O-Master

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    There is a roller coaster called "Storm Runner" in Hersheypark, Pennsylvania that launches from 0 to 72mph in two seconds flat. I watched it launch twice and my neck felt sore just looking at it!

    I have an EV - a 2015 smart fortwo ED. Although a 2-seater, it's surprisingly roomy, and off the line up to about 35 mph, can hole shot a Porsche Panamera. I also have a Mercedes E350 4Matic coupe, which has a 305hp v6. The few times I've mashed the go pedal, my neck has almost snapped. The Merc stays mostly in my garage, as I don't have a long commute to work (~6 miles) and I have a Level 2 charger at home, so the range and charge times don't bother me.
     
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  10. rocknrollrich

    rocknrollrich Most Honored Senior Member

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    You're on fire today.
    And the country that starts with the letter C, leading the way in clean anything, is the most laughable thing I've ever friggin heard.

    Man people have short memories.
    Remember the driving ban pre Olympics, just so the air could be breathable and look clear for the world to see?

    Yeah.... let's take out cues from them guys.
    We live in an upside down world, where good is called bad, and bad is called good. It would be amusing to me, except I live on this planet.
     
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  11. cranky

    cranky Senior Stratmaster

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    I aim to elect leaders who respect the sciences and represent common interests rather than special interests.

    Sciences should be protected from the vicissitudes of electability and the kindergarten-esque popularity contests that it implies.

    The environment is something we all hold in common. It's not political. Humans are not above the ecosystems they inhabit.

    #dumpingindixie
     
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  12. RoyC

    RoyC Senior Stratmaster

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    We are being asked to pay the price so that they can have more and more aeroplanes.
     
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  13. rocknrollrich

    rocknrollrich Most Honored Senior Member

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    Everyone "follows the science" until it no longer suits their agenda.
    Then it's called "using common sense" and sciencey stuff goes out the window.
    And that's not a "partisan" statement.
    It applies to all involved in governing.
     
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  14. cranky

    cranky Senior Stratmaster

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    For example?
     
  15. T Bone Slort

    T Bone Slort "Was you ever bit by a dead bee?" Silver Member

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    I have an 09 Mustang convertible (lower centre of gravity) which I have set up for the places I drive (Eibach pro kit performance lowering springs {speed bumps are not my friend}, bump-stop, urethane bushings, front strut tower brace, over width Nitto Motivo rubber) namely Highway 101 (if you have driven it between Langdale and Earls Cove, you'll know what I mean) and Highway 3 the Crowsnest to Nelson; so ya my car handles and it rides harder than a F150.
    I have driven my friends Tesla 3 and it is faster, and handles as well or better than my Mustang.
     
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  16. keys88

    keys88 Strat-Talker

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    There have been some great advancements but the technology still has a long way to go before I could consider buying one. We make a lot of long road trips in a year. Our longest is a 12-hour drive that we typically make a few times a year. We do it all in one day and we only stop for gas and bathroom breaks. I can stop, fill up with gas, and be back on the road in 5 minutes. And I can find a gas station even in the middle of nowhere. Electric vehicles just can’t compete with that yet.
     
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  17. Andrew Wasson

    Andrew Wasson Senior Stratmaster

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    I'm not sure what the conversation evolved to... Are we talking about EV's still?
     
  18. cranky

    cranky Senior Stratmaster

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    I honestly think @rocknrollrich is making a generic statement that gives people license to preemptively shirk science.
     
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  19. T Bone Slort

    T Bone Slort "Was you ever bit by a dead bee?" Silver Member

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    Yes that is true, and EV's at this point in their development are not for everyone.
    And neither were automobiles at the dawn of their existence when they were unreliable, you bought your gas from the local drugstore if they carried it because there were virtually no gas stations
    and you could pretty much count on at lease one flat tire every outing.
    For the most part people traveled long distances by train until the interstate highway system was built in the mid 50's "See the USA in your Chevrolet"
     
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  20. apm1991

    apm1991 Senior Stratmaster

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    if it came with a clutch I'd get one maybe.... I work from home now though and I only put about 2000-3000 miles a YEAR on my 2009 Honda Civic that has 100,000 miles on it.... The best thing I can do financially for myself and the best thing I can do for the environment (with today's technology) would be to keep the car another 30-40 years
     
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