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Vintage Owners I have a Question

Discussion in 'Pre-CBS Strats (before 1966)' started by bluesman1956, Oct 24, 2018.

  1. Dickey69

    Dickey69 Strat-Talk Member

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    Here is, IMHO, the difference between an original guitar & a re-issue. This goes for other manufacturers, too: The new guitars are WAY better in terms of fit & finish & consistency of quality. It's not so much that vintage guitars sound better; The original guitars are more "touch-sensitive". IOW, you could say they "play themselves". On a re-issue, you hafta fight to sound your best. I first noticed this when I got my '66 Emmons pedal steel guitar..it played effortlessly; I couldn't sound bad on it if I tried. Same with my '65 Mosrite Ventures guitar...anything I want to play is just THERE.
    Now, I am not a fan of Les Pauls. A buddy of mine brought his '76 Paul to one of my gigs to try, & it just played itself. Can't do that with a new one.
    Also...vintage guitars have the sound you grew up listening to, so that will appeal to most people over a new one.
    The only new guitars I like are Custom Shop; they are as close to the original as you will get.
     
  2. Danmax

    Danmax New Member!

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    Heck yeah. I've been stopping by Strat-Talk for a couple years just to read what other Strat owners talk about and also to read about some of the fixes. At any rate, I have a nice Black early 70's Strat Body I bought back in late July. If I post some pictures is there anyone who'd know if it's actually an early 70's? Apart from the larger straight boxier pickup cavity's & the routed area in the bridge cavity, I was told it was a 1968 through 1973. Guy in Germany was selling one just like mine on eBay & did sell it for $1,300 USD to a guy here in the states. Guy did give me some pointers but I'll stick to the people here. I know that there's plenty of smart people here that know what to look for.... Thanks for letting me post this here. I can't get anything to work right on the site tonight. Like refresh or move to another page. I keep getting some website error from the Strat-Talk Server....
     
  3. Zwitter

    Zwitter Strat-Talker

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    All new gibsons are just factory replicas
     
  4. knotanother1

    knotanother1 Strat-Talk Member

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    I can tell you the AVRI are extremely good however playing a real deal is amazing the guitars in the pictures left to right are and 82, 84, 82, 71(4bolt) 67 and the far right is a 63. So to answer your question if you can afford to buy a real deal and hold on to it then treat yourself. However not all of them at any year were perfect.
     

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  5. Mipstoo

    Mipstoo Senior Stratmaster

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    Wait....
    So you take a picture of your guitars... and you decide to frame only 1/3rd of the 1963????

    ;)
     
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  6. gitapik

    gitapik Strat-Talk Member

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    This one’s on a very current note for me:

    I was having some problems with the frets on my Silo Special, so I brought it in to a very good shop, here in NYC, ready to pay the extra $$$. The tech said he might be able to fix it quickly and sent me out into the showroom, saying I should try out some of the guitars.

    There are a LOT of vintage guitars in this shop, and I decided to check out the all original ‘58 Strat with the well worn maple board. Sale price: $28,500.00

    These guys wouldn’t put anything out on the floor unless it was in the best shape it could possibly be. And it was, true to form, excellent!

    However:

    That’s my ‘57 AVRI Strat, up in the Avatar field (slightly out of focus!). The board is only slightly worn and the finish only has a few dings...but I’ve always thought it was special and if this taste test of the original ‘58 is any indicator; then I’ve been right.

    After getting the Silo back (fixed and free for 15 minutes of work...I’ll be returning there for sure), I rushed home and plugged in my Strat. And: it really IS all that.

    I think that, just as when we go into a shop and play a bunch of the same model guitars, looking for the one that’s “right” for us, some are just a better fit than others. For whatever reasons. Even among the custom shops and boutique builders. And it’s been that way forever.
     
  7. Bazz Jass

    Bazz Jass Chairman of the Fingerboard Strat-Talk Supporter

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    Yeah, I could have personally tolerated seeing only a 1/3 of the printer and the whole of that 63 ;)
     
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  8. driesenries

    driesenries New Member!

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    The only thing I known witch makes a big difference is the weight of the guitar. I own a Fender 62AVRI and a 74 hardtail stratocaster. The last one weights 3.1kg and sounds huge and resonant compare with the vintage reissue. To be honest, the 62 vintage reissue sounds and plays like every average guitar compare with the 74. Recently bought a vintage Gibson SGjr that has a 2.6kg on the scale. These two lightweights are, hands down, the best sounded guitars i have ever played in my whole life.
    Most old and vintage guitars are a pain in the ass to play and the so called "Mojo" is just the wear and tear and the lack of care. The SGjr and the 74 are in mint+++ condition without a beaten life.
     
  9. Mipstoo

    Mipstoo Senior Stratmaster

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    I disagree... It has not everything to do with weight. But old does not always equal good.

    The SG from Paul?
     
  10. RussV

    RussV Senior Stratmaster

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    I played an unplugged Japanese made 62 replica many years ago and the neck felt exactly the same as my original 62.
     
  11. leifrobertson

    leifrobertson Strat-Talk Member

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    ok I have a new suhr, a CS, a 84 62 ri Fullerton, a 79 Fullerton (all American) and then a Fullerton era (80s) mij superstrat that’s worn in crazy bit modded with emg hots I had set up and definitely a refret job on a super worn in.


    Let me tell you the older for real..the better it feels. My favorite strat I own is the 84 mij worn in like crazy (it’s been really played) but modded and kept up with. Best neck ever. My second favorite would be my 79. I really am not impressed with the CS. The suhr is damn nice but I just play the old modded hap strat as my go to because it’s been through the mill and worn in nicely. It’s not in my head.
    Now I’ve bought strats after 2000 and I hated all of them. Oh yeah I have a 95 too which is ok but the best is my American Fullerton and my mij Fullerton.
    Nothing beats a worn in strat. You can’t fake that tone or the way it feels.

    I only buy older worn in strats now. Used old strats are the best. IMO

    probably gonna get rid of most of my guitars because that’s all I play. Early mid 80s strats. Seem to be great. I have PRs collecting dust along with a CS. Lol. Good luck but yeah a real vintage beats a fake one any day. Sure I modded mine to keep up with them but they are worn in. Blind fold test any day. Pretty much only pick up the two. Good luck but you get more for your value with the right year strat. I like my CS and suhr but I keep picking up my heavy 79 and my two 80s even more.
     
  12. Stratomike

    Stratomike Strat-Talk Member

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    I wanted to stay out of this thread because a) it follows the typical pattern of (expectable) mostly subjective comments (which is fine, we're all humans) and b) I have never played a pre-CBS so I can't really contribute. Nevertheless I read through all of the pages.

    Again as expected nothing unexpected turned up except for this one:

    Still not sure I buy the "old wood sounds better" theory, but the thing with the pots is really interesting. I was always thinking wtf was Fender thinking when they use(d) the pots that make the volume control such a PITA. For me a treble bleed is a must. So when the original ones were working like you describe, it would make perfect sense.

    That was a good read, thanks, and manifests my thoughts around this age-old debate :)
     
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  13. gitapik

    gitapik Strat-Talk Member

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    Agreed. That was a great read.

    I don’t know in what year my AVRI Strat was made. I bought it used in 2009. But it’s a wonderful guitar.

    I used to be on an out of the way forum where John Suhr was a regular. Pretty sure I remember him saying that the poles on the older pickups were of a different material than is used today. That it made a difference.

    Wish I could find that post. Anyone hear of that...?
     
  14. Adam Wolfaardt

    Adam Wolfaardt Strat-Talker

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    Dave Stephens explains it on his YouTube channel. It's impossible to manufacture pickups or magnet wire to the exact specs that were used in the old days. The technology has changed so much that it just can't be done the same way
     
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  15. NikiJo

    NikiJo New Member!

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    Vintage guitars are lovely, but the prices are astronomical. If you want a '57 strat or a '52 tele, I'd contract Fender custom shop & tell them you want one identical to how they were originally made, but with modern QC. Custom shop also do relic work:)
     
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  16. gitapik

    gitapik Strat-Talk Member

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    Right.

    $28.5k for that ‘58 Strat...

    :eek:
     
  17. Stratomike

    Stratomike Strat-Talk Member

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    Still peanuts compared to 50's Les Pauls!
     
  18. dueducs

    dueducs Senior Stratmaster

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    We hear this a lot, but I have always wondered about the specifics of this statement. I study technological change over time for my job bronze-age to Roman period, but also industrial age technologies and how they morphed into the 20th century. So, I ask myself, how can we not produce the same raw material or even final products we produced 50-60 years ago? The technology hasn't been lost to time, so exactly how are the magnets different? What is different in the pickup assembly process that cannot be replicated? I don't have a solid, feasible answer. I get that nitrocellulose finishes may be different due to regulatory changes, but copper wire? Are there regulatory changes that affect (in any significant manner) the way wire is produced? I've never looked into this direct question, and the others are rhetorical questions- not necessarily expecting an answer- just points to ponder.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
  19. Mipstoo

    Mipstoo Senior Stratmaster

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    You answered yourself... It's all about regulation or preservation.
    May it be final product or a side-product used in the production process, if we can not make it anymore today, it's mostly because somewhere in the line, there's something harmful to us or the environment. If not, it's often about preservation because of scarcity.
     
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  20. dueducs

    dueducs Senior Stratmaster

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    You are right, I (possibly, we) just do not know the specifics of any presumed regulatory changes that might make replication impossible or pertinent.
     
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